I agree that talent pays a HUGE roll in a graphic designer’s ability to succeed. Like everything else in life, though, i think that hard work, dedication, and LUCK are crucial as well. Is a vote for the perfect balance acceptable?

A wise man once said about DJing:
“digging (for records) wont make a bad DJ good, but it will make a good DJ better.”

put into context, education wont make a bad designer good, but will make a good designer better.
Talent and education on their own are mediocre, the two combined are exceptional.

I was at uni just over a year ago. I studied a FdA in Digital Media Production (a mixed bag) at London College of Communication (Part of University of the Arts London). Generally this is considered one of the best unis for that arts but after being there for 2 years I can tell you. It’s not, at all.

The teaching is slack and uninformed, they have poor equipment, and are badly disorganized. However, a large number of the students there produce some amazing work, MUCH better than the teachers own work.

The correlation between the students and high quality work was not defined by how hard they studied the course materials or even if they got a high grade in each of the modules.

The students who produced the best work dossed around in class, they were simply buying time while they developed their skills on their own. They took enormous pride in their personal work or the projects that perked their interest, and took very little notice of what the course material was. They were 100% committed to design, development or their chosen specialty, basically living the cliche of eat, sleep, breathe .

So my point is I think you can learn design, but you have to drive yourself. I don’t think it can be taught. This can also give the illusion of "natural talent", but I don’t think it’s natural at all, it’s a drive to be good at what they do, and so they learn, HARD.

Research carried out in to the success of graduates from a London fashion degree found that the most successful relied on networks built up during their studies rather than skills.
Sociologists call this social capital (who you know). Cultural capital (what you know - this doesn’t include “skills” but means knowledge of the field such as who’s doing what, where things are happening) is important too.
Being able to keep track of the ins and outs of the business you’re in, and being able to network, are far more important than technical skill. So the most “successful” designers are the “creative” ones who are in the right place at the right time and who can bring the right people on board at the right time. The “artworkers” are the grunts.
Sadly, many students attend courses to get technical skills. And even more tragically many courses only focus on those. Technical skill, which is what you see at shows like the one you went to, don’t tell you about the person’s actual abilities as a designer. Trust me - I’ve taught more design graduates than I’ve had hot dinners and the ones I’m proudest of are rarely the ones who put up the best show.

So what I’m saying is define “good” and “great”. I teach design and I have been a designer for 20 years. But I’m self-taught. So I’m a big believer in not needing a qualification. But I don’t teach people “how to” design, but “about” design (which means “the world” in my book). Because if you’re great at photoshop but haven’t any intellectual curiosity, you’ll never be a “designer”, only an “artworker”.
However if you have intellectual curiosity, but can’t tell one end of a mouse from another, you have the makings of a designer. The design process is much bigger than you’d think looking at the curriculum of most design courses (which emphasise technical skill over “knowledge”)

And a designer isn’t defined by the ability to “appreciate good design” but by the ability to think creatively. I know many, many excellent designers who have crap taste. It really doesn’t matter.

This argument is old and can always be answered logically: there are great designers who have poor taste, and/or poor technical skills. There are great designers who have great taste and/or great technical skills. Equally there are rubbish designers who fit those categories.

At the end of the day designers are more made than born, but much of it relies on the environment - opportunity, networks - rather than “talent” as I think you’re defining it. A designer in London will likely be more successful than a designer in the middle of nowhere because they can’t walk down a street without tripping over an opportunity. But the “skill” lies in taking advantage of it. And sadly you won’t have seen that evidenced in the show you went to…

I definitely agree that hard work can help you be better, but talent is just exactly what will make the difference.
Check out Jean Michel Basquiat’s work. It seems his paintings were come out of him (can we say that in english ??) All his work is so equilibrated and well constructed.
Some painters work a lot, every day, but will just never be Jean Michel Basquiat.
Graphic design can follow that rule too…

Some combination of the two. This is such an old debate. Oh, and I agree with Simon, above.

Just like eating. Natural talent earlier. Learning and practice later. A good design could let people understand easier and love it.

I second Jonathan’s comments above and I’m afraid I bulk at the terms ‘natural, gifted and god-given’. When children spell something wrong at primary school they are told they’ve done it wrong, when they draw something, regardless of its merit, they are praised. This sends out confusing messages. Creativity is not taken as seriously at ‘formal’ education. Therefore those that maybe aren’t as good at spelling tend to veer towards practical subjects because they get the praise at an early age. This has nothing to do with talent and the old adage the more you do something the better you get at it when applied from such an early age, must have effect on future life choices and how well you do something.

However, there are so many other factors that mold a student before they get to university that have also got to be factored into any discussion such as this. What about background, financial support, encouragement from a young age, choices at school, style of teaching at secondary school, disabilities guiding choices etc etc etc. Who is the measurer of talent in such a subjective field and where does ‘talent’ come from?

I would argue that it is experience and enthusiasm that are the factors that should be being discussed here and most importantly how one chooses to apply these. I’ve seen very talented, but lazy students throw their chances away and produce, frankly, shockingly bad work when I know they can do better. I’ve also seen students with little initial ‘talent’ go a very long way with the right support, encouragement and enthusiastic guidance.

You also have to consider the numbers of students on a course and contact time between students and lecturers. On a course that attracts lots of students, then the ratios are going to be huge and some students, the shy, the less ‘gifted’, the ones with issues outside of education, are going to sink and not get the attention they need.

And ultimately I would hate to think that this sort of elitist attitude would put off students who maybe think they don’t have ‘talent’. Are you proposing finishing schools or is this education we are discussing here?

Each of us is born with certain degrees of given talents. Some us have more, some of us have less. Not much we can do about that.

People who develop their talents have developed skills. Highly talented, dedicated people develop skills more rapidly. Folks with huge talents who dedicate themselves to developing skills that express their talents produce the best work. Folks with little talent who exercise a strong work ethic are capable of producing good work. Folks with little talent and a weak work ethic should look for a different calling.

At the end of the day nothing is going to help you more than Talent if you are going to Succeed, not just as a Designer but at anything in Life. A Degree is no replacement for Talent - although the hard work required to gain one is the best way to bring out any Talents you may have… I don´t think Talent is an Elitist concept either, Degree Waving is Elitist, and I much prefer to be recognized for any of my Talents, however minimal they are- than for my Academical Qualifications. We are all born with Talents and it is up to ourselves to recognize and nurture those talents and to use them however we see fit. To be honest I nearly got thrown out of my diploma course at college for my “Talents” “and setting a bad example” by partying and fooling around while maintaining a 90+ average. I think instead of being Elitist about needing Talent and Degrees we should be being kind and educating those aspiring to being Great Designers.

Glad to see this subject discussed! I’ve been reviewing designers’ work for over 25 years, first as the head of creative at a Fortune 100 company, then as a creative recruiter.

My opinion is that creative talent is not teachable, it is innate. So if someone who was born with it goes to college (assuming a decent school), they will come out well. But if someone without an iota of talent decides to spend their (or their parents’) hard-earned money on 4 years of design study, they will more than likely finish school poor and with dismal employment opportunities if they insist they want a design job.

Reputable universities, like SCAD or RISD, would screen-out people seeking to study design if they are completely talentless. However far too many of the ‘for profit’ colleges, like Westwood or those online universities, have no qualms about encouraging a talentless person into pursuing a design degree because all they are interested in is signing up another student. I wish this travesty could be corrected.

So I agree with the others here who have stated that schooling will make a good designer better, but will not make ANYONE into a designer.

I guess you’re not talking on the education but whether someone can achieve their goal with hardwork and dedication alone.

For me, talent is something to ease up your learning process. Like sport, people who have talent can learn the basic quicker, they are creative in making a new strategy etc.

As for designer, it is also the same. There are many people can become designer, the difference is their level, people with talent learn faster, make breakthrough, and usually have their ownstyle.

But it doesn’t mean someone who doesn’t have talent can’t surpass them. Almost everything in this world can be learned, it just the time and how perfect they can master.

So my vote goes for “enthusiasm” (honestly, usually people with talent in their area will have enthusiasm)

yea this is very true.. i know how to use all these programs.but alot of times i need that inspirational spark!!

I’ll Go For Talent Too..!!
And Practice make them better.
Without a Talent and if practice it would be harder, In my opinion great designers go to universities for a certificate cux without it they cant get a job, so better to have a Portfolio from your very young age,

I use to think talent can be taught, but the older I get, the more I feel different. Sure, everyone is born with that creative portion in their brain, but like every other muscle in your body, if you don’t use it, you lose it. That’s why most of us have good imaginations when we’re little. Society has taught us not to use our imaginations—that it’s all “kid stuff.” A lot of us tend to listen to that.

I think that a successful designer will be someone who read. knowledge is a powerful tool, that designers should have in order to create a outstanding art. Education is a must for a designer to understand the basic of designing. Talent…., I do believe it is the sole element that most of us strongly believes that differentiate the successful and not successful designer. I think, what makes a person creative is how he/she sees the world.(world view, value).

I strongly Believe that natural given talent plays a huge roll and it could be learned. To be successful you need to learn from others, learn how to be technical in certain cases, and know your art history at the same time. Natural talent is great but success is limited. Especially when it comes do to a money aspect. You can be a phenomenal designer but if your text placement is off, or the message doesn’t get a across how its meant to be you will fail when it comes to getting commissioned for your work.

And yes you can learn to be an artist because at the end of the day art is art. Its a freedom of expression and sometimes the best art isnt technical or even understood. Its in the eye of the beholder.

Talent + Passion + Knowledge = Success

I think that there are several things to look at when discovering exactly what it was that has made a successful designer… successful.
Artistic talent is something that can’t be taken away, but honing those skills is almost as important as having them in my opinion.
Passion and the drive to do something with the talent, and of course having talent and drive doesn’t necessarily mean a person has the social skill or business sense to obtain the opportunities it takes to become successful.

my two cents.

I do not believe graphic design is something that can be taught without their firstly being some form of talent and artistic gift.

@ Joshua: EXACTLY! Everyone is born with that creative portion in their brains. It’s just like every other muscle in the body—if you don’t use it, you lose it. As we grow up, we’re forced to believe that our imaginations will not get us very far in the “real business world.” So most people put more emphasis on math, english and history. After a while, we, as adults, forget how to use that creative portion.

The lack of actual emphasis on the fundamentals of what constitutes good design are being lost as more and more people think that owning a computer and a couple of expensive design programs make you a graphic designer. The market is saturated with self proclaimed graphic designer who have not learned the fundamentals of design. This in turn makes it harder for those of us who have slaved through design school and payed our dues to command the salaries we deserve as less qualified individuals do work for low rates and churn out horrible designs that make all of us look bad as designers.

@SIPIWE I would have to agree that the industry is being devalued by the idea that owning a computer and opening up Photoshop or Illustrator makes you a graphic designer. It is also unfortunate that the market is so over-saturated with these professed graphic designers.

I feel the best thing we can do is continue to educate clients, and do what we can to raise the bar and widen the gap between actual graphic designers and these others, as well as educate them as to what good design really is.

Rather than talent vs education, I think it’s more about recognizing that graphic design as art will ALWAYS be subjective – to the artist, other artists and to the client. Knowledge of the field (education) is vital and necessary to create great work that utilizes the formal “rules” of graphic design (and there ARE rules); creativity and skill (talent & application) are vital to breaking outside of those set rules to produce something great and innovative.

But who says what is “good” design, then? The artist who followed the rules but may not seem as talented? The artist who broke outside the box but whose ideas seem a little too creative? Or the client who pays for work that is effective but perhaps not what the artist would choose? Sure there will be a point where all three align, however to my point – talent and education are both relevant but subjectivity still remains at the top. Can you measure artistic talent, really? I’d like to hear what people think about Andres Serrano’s “Piss Christ” – talented artistically, intellectually or just crazy? Subjective. And that is where graphic design as a customer service industry gets tricky – we aim to please 1) the client 2) ourselves 3) our peers/idols.

Regarding talent vs education though, as people have mentioned, a certain level of talent is innate but it can also be refined. What is considered little talent can be made large with determination, effort and practice. What is considered big talent can be made greater in the same way. Still, it is subjective because graphic design at its essence is art, and people will always differ in opinion on that subject.

As a graduate with a degree in graphic arts, I have to say that no doubt without the talent or as you term it ‘the spark,’ few can really excel. When it comes to the arts especially, this is never more true. However, graphic arts degree was extremely intensive and combined a blend of pure art and creativity as well as hardcore computer training and project work. Without the hard work and determination needed, I don’t believe I would have gotten to where I am today.

Maybe it’s too late to post my comment.

It is a fact that natural talents is the main factor to success in graphic design world. Grad student of art rarely to make a masterpiece of art because they were always follow the same pattern and method that they learn from their formal education. It’s differ with natural talented designer because they always tend to break the usual with brand new one and unusual because they born creative and imaginative.

Despite it, the grad student posses a lot of technical skills and making art more efficiently. That’s because they learn how to use the device/equipment for design deeper than natural talented designer (although it can be learn from tutorial, it won’t be easy and fast).

So, graphic design it’s all about art which need the creativity and imagination as the primary requirement and it can’t be learned. Education is just a way to shape the skills and gain legimation.

Remember that a cat can’t be a lion and a lion need to learn how to become a true predator…

^_~

I personally think that it is down to work. A ‘natural’ designer is just someone who dose not view his research as work. As such he is always thinking about it and looking for inspiration when out and about.

I agree. Not just because a designer graduated in a graphics school she/he can be successful without talent. There is a lot of designer out their who didn’t go to graphic school but we can say they are successful because they have the talent.

Education is not a matter of good designer its all about the creative mind of others. best of luck.

Absolutely both - tallent and education, because education helps to operate better with tallent one has. And tallent gives original ideas, gives inspiration, a special deep understanding and exclusive realization. Just that different designers/artists have different proportion of both.

I am a print-broker and I do most of my own design work. I have had no formal training in design but have worked with coreldraw for 20 years. On top of it all I am colour blind. Most of my customers love my designs. I don’t always know what makes something look good, but I always know when something looks bad - and there is a lot of bad out there. One the other hand asthetically pleasing composion is not always what sells and most of the time it is what sells that is important. So it would seem that I am coming down on the side of natural talent, but truely I am only a mediocre designer and often wish I was formally trained. When design work goes over my head, I simply broker that out too.

Natural talent…100% Sure a lot of people can understand the necessity of “negative space” or the psychological use typography but then what are you going to do with that knowledge if you’re not artistically adept? It’s kind of like needing legs to walk…

After 12 years in design my biggest pet peeve is still: just because you can whip up a cheesy flyer or print some labels that doesn’t MAKE you a graphic designer nor prove you’re all that artistic.

If anyone is still reading this and can respond, I am seriously contemplating a design degree, I have been a natural artist all my life, so much so that I took it for granted, and am now thinking if I were to train I would enhance my skill but so far the design schools are over the top expensive. I am in my early 40′s so hesitant to take on such a huge debt at this stage in my life. Can anyone recommend a school in the San Francisco Bay Area where I can learn the principles of design at a reasonable cost? I have tried my local community college and the classes were quite pedestrian. Are there good, fast paced classes to be had at a community college or vocational school? I am so far teaching myself and I learn pretty quickly - am looking for a challenge without the 100K pricetag. Any suggestions? If so please email sharonknight777@gmail.com

I believe that natural talent you should have a little to create unique pieces of work. I have learned and practiced designing all from the web, by watching videos, reading, following tutorials.

As long as you keep practicing and trying to improve, you can get really good. You also must make sure you have the right tools for the job.

God Given Talent is my vote - Schooling may add to the thought processes but doesn’t necessarily make a designer think like one.

Keep doing.

In my opinion (after teaching college Graphic Design for seven years) I would say that talent is for sure the difference…let’s hear you sing right now?…some people can naturally do it. It may be frustrating but not everyone is fit for every job.

Education is important, so is talent, but there is so much more involved in design. Critical thinking problem solving, a technical knowledge to prep your art for printing.

I think education and talent are both important, but one doesn’t cancel out the other. I think the choice of school is imortant too…I was fortunate enough to choose a design school where the instructors demanded alot out of you and pushed you hard and had very high standards, and not only looked at your creativity but your technical skill as well.

Great discussion, but sadly there are a lot of people who seem confused. Graphic Design is Visual Communication whilst Art is Creative expression. I see a lot of excellent art being past off these days as design, it’s not. One person commented above “You can be a phenomenal designer but if your text placement is off, or the message doesn’t get a across…” I’m sorry to tell you this but if your text placement is off or the message doesn’t get across you’ve failed as a designer, even though it may be a beautiful piece of art.
Graphic Design is about communication not pretty pictures

Possessing a large amount of passion does not equal great design. I know plenty of designers who are passionate about what they do but boy are they awful.
Technique and processes can be learnt. You can learn how to use software to output a logo or ad etc. But ideas can’t be taught. Great designers have a natural talent to see things in a different way. Their brains just work differently. That’s why there are usually only a handful of great designers who graduate from the same school. They were always going to be great designers.

You need three things. Inspiration. Motivation. Creativity. Everyone gets all three at some point. Nothing will come of it it without the other two though. Just because you might get two out of three sometimes, doesn’t mean you stop trying.

The more you try, the more chance of creating something. Everyone has a talent for at least one of those three areas. An idea just needs the right place and mind.

That can be said of all degress. Not everyone who picks a major is gifted at it, not everyone will seek a career in in, and most will be run of the mill employees if they do. The difference is graphic design is like photography…everyone has access to the technology to dabble and claim ownership.

What passes for creativity today is often blatant theft. Talent is often scrutinized and evaluated in such subjective ways that it isn’t recognized (the phrase “ahead of his/her time” comes to mind). Most people have a creative talent, but creative endeavors are often laughed at because they are outside the norm. Most creative people are demoralized at a young age and don’t have the heart to continue. I think the most important quality in a great artist is bravery, moreso than “talent” or skill.

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